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  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by josta59 View Post
    Huh, that's pretty unique. So can troops that need rallying still move in that game? Or does that only apply to troops that happened to be in that hex already?

    With many miniatures rules, including mine, disrupted units can't do anything. They're basically pinned down, or panicked, or wounded...you can't really tell in Quik Frik. So they wouldn't be able to move to where the leader was.

    Also, skirmish miniatures scenarios typically take place in an area of ground often represented by one hex of a board game! So everyone is already in that hex. LOL
    Actually, I got that wrong a little — it’s ANY roll they have to make, they get the extra die roll. So, if a unit moved into the hex with owing fire, it would roll an extra die; or if a unit moved into the hex, and next turn fired a weapon, it’d get an extra die.

    Yeah, you’re right on the disrupted thing... generally, those units can’t move or fire until they Rally, but if they happen to be in that hex and get disrupted, they’d get that extra die roll!

    And good point on the differences noted at the end, LOL.
    "If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking." - George S. Patton.

  2. #32
    Super Moderator josta59's Avatar
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    Today I'm going to try my newest rules revision using the latest scenario I wrote, which I haven't played at all yet. It's a much, much smaller scenario, so it will be completely different than what I've been doing.

    I'm rewriting the scenario here to fit with my Quik Frik rules, rather than the No End in Sight rules.

    Stopped at the Checkpoint, scenario details

    Situation
    Night scenario on a lit street. No one is equipped with night vision goggles.

    Objectives
    SPAR (attackers): Escape the checkpoint northward, so they can recon the factory.
    SPLM-IO (defenders): Kill the SPAR scouts.

    Deployment
    SPLM-IO will set up first along Street Daves Parade. The SPAR scouts will arrive in a car, arriving on Street Daves Parade from the south.

    Special rules

    SPLM-IO moves first each turn.

    Because it's night, attacks and reaction fire may only be conducted within a range of 6".

    Order of battle
    SPLM-IO:
    1 squad of 7 infantry, 1 with SAW
    1 squad leader, reactive (automatically moves 1d3" away from figure targeted by grenade)

    SPAR:
    1 team of 3 elite infantry scouts with small arms, quick (add 2" to movement in addition to other movement bonuses)
    1 team leader, iron jaw (subtract 1 friction point every time friction points are sustained)
    1 car, no weaponry
    Last edited by josta59; 02-15-2020 at 02:51 PM.

  3. #33
    Super Moderator josta59's Avatar
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    The squad full of Chinese scouts rolls up to the checkpoint.

    Attachment 2816

    This will trigger a lot of opportunity fire that could bring this game to a very quick end.Name:  20200215_135831.jpg
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    Last edited by josta59; 02-15-2020 at 04:01 PM.

  4. #34
    Super Moderator josta59's Avatar
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    Three rebels opened fire, causing plenty of friction, but only one scout in the back seat was disrupted. The scout next to him shot the rebel with the SAW, disrupting him.

  5. #35
    Super Moderator josta59's Avatar
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    Very quick but satisfying game. There wasn't much to show, since the action started so close up.

    Attacks are less accurate when a figure is moving, so they mostly tried to attack without moving, until things started getting bad for the rebels and those still able to act finally took cover.

    BTW, the rebels didn't throw grenades because they were close enough to the car to cause themselves friction if they did.

    The elite scouts caused enough disruption that they could try to drive away, but the driver had been disrupted for several turns. So I had the iron jaw team leader spend a movement switching seats with him. Just then, the rebel squad leader finally rallied, making it easier for all the rebels to rally. The rebel leader fired at the scout leader, and then the car took off into the darkness, just as the rebel SAW rallied for the first time in the game!

    The rules feel very right now. It's much harder for figures to rally, and that makes the game actually playable. The action was intense, but the rules were balanced enough that the elite scouts with their iron jaw leader were just barely able to fight off the rebel squad and make an ugly getaway. Again, very satisfying.

    I want to make a couple more tweaks to the rules, and then they'll finally be ready to share.

  6. #36
    Super Moderator josta59's Avatar
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    I just realized, the way my rules are set up, if the rebels had attacked the car instead of the scouts inside, the scouts would've received the same friction as the vehicle, and the rebels would've won easily. Simply adding a special scenario rule that friction to the car doesn't affect the occupants would prevent that from happening.

    I'm a firm believer that rules should be simple, and any complexities should be handled by the scenario details.

  7. #37
    Member madman's Avatar
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    I want to address this. I am comparing it to NEiS as it is mentioned. For how NEiS handles it see my thread here;

    http://www.wargamingdropzone.com/sho...=5883#post5883

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by josta59 View Post
    Using either rule set, the rebels are too powerful, and with my own rules, I end up in a stalemate since there are no rules for instant death upon touching, as there are with No End in Sight. The game just becomes frustrating when no one can be killed.
    IN NEiS close combat can be deadly. Probably more so than ranged fire as you stated. Your rules have no kills in CC or lower chance?

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whiterook View Post
    Of course, my experience being more with board games, that may be skewed to not pertinent but... I’ve mostly seen systems where, if the Leader is disrupted, the units under their influence cannot rally. The thought being, the men are confused or in disarray, and temporarily stymied in action. That always made sense to me. I guess if you’re thinking along that line of thought, you’d best need to figure out a way to factor a Zone of Control in around that leader, if the units would indeed be dependent on a leader to act effectively. Where it gets sketchy is farther away.... would a unit out of earshot be unable to be influenced by a leader and thereby act independently (perhaps a die roll for independent thinking).

    Also, Rally should ever be an easy thing... on the battlefield, it takes very little to throw the whole area in chaos.

    Just thoughts.
    This whole idea seems to add much more "stuff" than I believe Scott would want in his stripped down rules. I think it may be more than I would add to NEiS as a basic rule but may add it as an special rule for leaders with the inspiring leadership style if being used.

  10. #40
    Member madman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by josta59 View Post
    I just realized, the way my rules are set up, if the rebels had attacked the car instead of the scouts inside, the scouts would've received the same friction as the vehicle, and the rebels would've won easily. Simply adding a special scenario rule that friction to the car doesn't affect the occupants would prevent that from happening.

    I'm a firm believer that rules should be simple, and any complexities should be handled by the scenario details.
    I am afraid I have to disagree. I see this as an either or situation. If this is the procedure you want followed then make it a rule. Unless in half the games you want it one way and in the other half you want it the other way nail it down. Is there a reason to make it one way or the other in your mind? It is only a line or two.

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